Validated

[ForWhoForWhat?]

FWFW,

I respect your views but your posts on education tend to focus on how any sort of oversight is a complete failure.

Thats not what this commission found ergo, that is not what this post is about. If anything it suggested that these recent oversight attempts were misguided at best.

But you don't offer any alternative options.

I thought we addressed my alternative options in the last thread. But to have any alternative in any situation, one needs to believe a rampant problem existed in the first place. In the case of evaluation, which was a small portion of this study, i don't believe there was a rampant preexisting problem that required a complete overhaul.

Traditional oversight HAS failed to some degree... And rather than hold the administrators accountable for allowing poor teachers to attain tenure, we've decided that they're doing a smash up job and we just need to find another way to evaluate teachers to get that nuisance of a task off the plate of the Administration...

That's a portion of my take.. :)

Agree with Payton. There is where i feel the problem of traditional teacher evals had its faults. I even shared my own experiences of reporting evidence of poor teachers to admin while the teacher was more easily fireable (or fixable) only to be ignored and the poor teacher was permitted to continue through the system.

[ForWhoForWhat?]

Do you at least acknowledge that it is very, very tricky to attempt to measure the "performance of their services"?

Ha! that would actually involve a modicum of critical thinking. We all know how Raid approaches that.

[ForWhoForWhat?]

I agree with this completely. I just don't find it particularly useful to continually point how any sort of oversight doesn't work.

again, that's not what the commissions report was about; hell it was barely highlighted in my summary!

[AndromedaPatFan]

I always laugh at Raid's use of Allah's name in vain.

Little-known (among folks who don't speak Arabic) fact: Allah is not just the Muslim god. Christian Arabs pray to Allah as well.

[lechrus2]

Not only by teachers. How about folks like you. So far... our "solutions" suck.

The fact of the matter is that our education system has many, many problems... especially at the lower end of the socio-economic scale. And this end of the scale is where the majority of the problems are...

Now: do you think teachers are the foundation of the problem(s) at the lower end of the socio-economic scale?

From what I've read, student grades are not correlated to the socio-economic scale, but race.

[Raid]

Gotcha, you are correct...

Or in raid-speak: "Better teachers are lazier and prefer to go where the kids teach themselves.".

In your world, apparently a teacher is a moron if they choose to work in an urban environment. Really now. Quite the objective opinion.

[Payton34]

In your world, apparently a teacher is a moron if they choose to work in an urban environment. Really now. Quite the objective opinion.

Not a moron at all... Not sure where you're getting that. Not rocket science that the best teachers who can write their own ticket would typically prefer to work in a system where the kids actually listen and there's more teaching and less babysitting involved...

Not really a phenomenon that is isolated to the teaching profession, ya know? More experienced servers would rather work at Ruth's Chris than TGI Friday's, capice?

[Raid]

Not really a phenomenon that is isolated to the teaching profession, ya know?

Finally. Nor are results of a service often tied to performance of a service.

[Payton34]

Finally. Nor are results of a service often tied to performance of a service.

One has zero to do with the other... Sorry, this isn't the "admission" you seem to think it is...