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  1. #1
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    2013 Quarterback Thread

    Feel like we should do some "ranking" to see how you see them going / who you think the best to worst is.



    How I think the Draft Will Go :

    1. Geno Smith (Cardinals , 1st)
    2. Ryan Nassib (Bills, 1st)
    3. Mike Glennon (Jets , 1st)
    4. Tyler Wilson (Cowboys, 1st)
    5. EJ Manuel (Chiefs , 2nd)
    6. Matt Barkley ( Browns, 2nd)


    How I rank the QBs :

    1. EJ Maneul , FSU
    2. Mike Glennon , NC St
    3. Ryan Nassib , Syracuse
    4. Geno Smith, WVu
    5. Tyler Wilson, Ark
    6. Matt Barkley , USC

  2. #2
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    Funny how we could probably get a ton of different answers for ranking this group...

    I definitely dont have Manuel as #1.

    1) Smith
    2) Wilson
    3) Barkley
    4) Glennon
    5) Bray
    6) Nassib
    7) Dysert
    8) Manuel

  3. #3
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    Wilson
    Barkley
    Glennon
    Jones
    Nassib

  4. #4
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    Wow, we start off with a Manuel for #1 post. THis is gonna be juicy.

    My list

    1. Geno
    2. Glennon
    3. Barkley(has to go to the right team, but I think he can play in this league)
    4. Wilson
    5. Nassib
    6. Manuel
    7. Jones(possible sleeper)

    After that I'm not really sure. I don't like Bray or Dysert much at all, but I'd at least take a flyer on Dysert. Bray is the Jevan SNead of this draft IMO.
    "Governing doesn’t disappear when government shrinks; instead corporations come to govern your life — like HMO’s, oil companies, drug companies, agribusiness, and so on, with accountability only to maximizing profit, not to public needs." - George Lakoff

  5. #5
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    Manuel. LOL. He's a terrible QB with monster tools. He might someday become great, though I consider it incredibly unlikely, but at this stage he's not in the same galaxy as Geno or, really, anyone. Haha.

    Good breakdown of the QBs courtesy of WalterFootball.com:

    Quarterback Rankings by Attributes

    Accuracy:
    NFL prototype: Aaron Rodgers, Packers

    Geno Smith
    Tyler Wilson
    Matt Barkley
    Ryan Nassib
    Landry Jones
    Zac Dysert
    E.J. Manuel
    Mike Glennon

    Recap: The most important characteristic for any quarterback in the NFL is accuracy. Not only do accurate quarterbacks reduce turnovers and maintain time of possession, they increase the opportunities for skill-position players to have a bigger impact. Smith is definitely the most accurate signal-caller in the 2013 NFL Draft.

    Smith's accuracy can be seen in his 71 percent completion percentage as a senior, even better than his 65 percent completion rate in 2011. College percentages are inflated, but Smith has superb ball placement and does a good job of throwing the ball in tight windows in all parts of the field.

    Wilson, Barkley and Nassib are all accurate passers. They are of the West Coast variety that work the short to intermediate part of the field. All three of them should have the potential of completing 60 percent of their passes in the NFL.

    Jones flashes great accuracy at times and then gets in streaks where he struggles. Dysert looked like that at the Senior Bowl. Manuel had a good completion percentage in college, but coaches told WalterFootball.com those numbers were inflated by his offense and weak competition. Those sources believe Manuel needs to improve his accuracy significantly to have shot at being an NFL starter.

    Glennon completed 58.5 percent of his passes in 2012. He can make some beautiful throws deep along the sideline and drop the ball in precisely down the field, but too often he is off the mark. Glennon needs to improve his footwork to become a more accurate quarterback. His feet are out rhythm too often and that prevents him from getting passes where they need to be. His inaccuracy also led to a lot of interceptions, 29, over the past two seasons.

    Strongest Arm:
    NFL prototype: Joe Flacco, Ravens

    Mike Glennon
    E.J. Manuel
    Geno Smith
    Zac Dysert
    Landry Jones
    Matt Barkley
    Ryan Nassib
    Tyler Wilson

    Recap: Glennon has the strongest arm of the class and can clearly spin the ball better than the others. Manuel also has a cannon for an arm to make all the throws at every level of the field. Smith, Dysert and Jones all have good arms that are capable of making all the throws required in the NFL.

    Nassib and Barkley have decent arms, but they don't have the ability to spin it like the other signal-callers. Neither can beat defensive backs solely with the strength of his arm. They need good anticipation, timing and ball location on throws downfield.

    Wilson did well in the short to intermediate part of the field at the Senior Bowl. However his arm doesn't look capable of driving the ball in the deep part of the field in the NFL.



    Field Vision:
    NFL prototype: Peyton Manning, Broncos

    Geno Smith
    Matt Barkley
    Tyler Wilson
    Mike Glennon
    Landry Jones
    Ryan Nassib
    Zac Dysert
    E.J. Manuel

    Recap: Smith is advanced at reading defenses and working through his progressions. He doesn't panic when his first read is covered and generally stays patient in the pocket.

    Barkley and Wilson both have been well-prepared with their college offenses. Both signal-callers do a good job of working through their options and are able to move their eyes quickly.

    Glennon shows potential for good field vision, but is too inconsistent. Jones is the same way.

    Dysert needs work on speeding up his progressions for the NFL. Manuel needs a lot of improvement. He showed progress at the Senior Bowl, but he would usually take off and run in college when his first option was covered.

    Decision-Making:
    NFL prototype: QB Tom Brady, Patriots

    Geno Smith
    Ryan Nassib
    Tyler Wilson
    Matt Barkley
    E.J. Manuel
    Zac Dysert
    Mike Glennon
    Landry Jones

    Recap: This was a tough one; Smith, Nassib, Wilson and Barkley were all pretty comparable. Smith won out because he threw the ball in the least amount of dangerous places and avoided interceptions. Nassib threw only 10 interceptions as a senior and was very reliable with his decision-making for Syracuse. Barkley would've been ranked first in decision-making last yeat, but he regressed as a senior and was forcing passes to covered receivers. Thus, his interceptions went up. Wilson had a senior-year regression as well.

    Manuel's decision-making struggled whenever he faced a good defense. Dysert also didn't stand out when he faced tougher competition. Glennon's decision-making needs serious improvement. He routinely made throws that were extremely questionable.

    Jones' reputation for shoddy decision-making is well known. If he was in Norman, and playing with a lead, he was solid. But against good defenses, Jones' decision-making was consistently bad.



    Intelligence:
    NFL prototype: Peyton Manning, Broncos

    Matt Barkley
    Tyler Wilson
    Geno Smith
    Ryan Nassib
    Mike Glennon
    Zac Dysert
    Landry Jones
    E.J. Manuel

    Recap: Barkley and Wilson are both intelligent signal-callers who already have a good basis of knowledge of an NFL offense. Smith is known around West Virginia as a dedicated patron of the film room. He will need time to learn an NFL offense, but he studies hard, so the habits are there for him to be a smart quarterback.

    Nassib is intelligent and that was noticed by scouts at the Senior Bowl. Glennon isn't significantly behind Nassib or Smith. Glennon is said to be smart enough.

    Jones is experienced and knows what to do, but it seems to be forgotten during the games in high-pressure situations. Manuel ran a very basic offense in college and will need a lot of classroom development in the NFL.

    Mobility:
    NFL prototype: Robert Griffin III, Redskins

    E.J. Manuel
    Geno Smith
    Tyler Wilson
    Zac Dysert
    Ryan Nassib
    Matt Barkley
    Mike Glennon
    Landry Jones

    Recap: Manuel and Smith are truly mobile quarterbacks with the ability to make big plays on the ground. Offensive coordinators will be able to use some of the en-vogue read-option plays that took the NFL by storm in 2012.

    Wilson moves well and can pick up yards on the ground. He has good scrambling ability to buy time and throw on the run. Dysert ran the ball well in college, but he won't be as effective at picking up yards in the NFL. Both should have the mobility to help avoid the pass rush.

    Nassib and Barkley can move around some. They can each buy some time, but neither is a threat to run with the ball.

    Glennon and Jones are pretty much statues in the pocket. Both got hit a lot when going against good pass rushes.

    Ball Security:
    NFL prototype: Tom Brady, Patriots

    Geno Smith
    Ryan Nassib
    Zac Dysert
    Tyler Wilson
    Matt Barkley
    E.J. Manuel
    Mike Glennon
    Landry Jones

    Recap: Smith had great ball security in college. The 3-year starter threw just 20 interceptions over three seasons with his highest totals being seven per year as a sophomore and junior. He has a real ability to avoid throwing interceptions and that sets him apart from the other signal-callers.

    Nassib and Dysert had good ball security as well; they're pretty even. Barkley and Wilson would've ranked higher last year before they significantly increased their turnovers as seniors.

    Manuel's decision-making was generally okay against weak teams, but it was pretty ugly against good defenses. The regular-season finale against Florida was an example.

    Glennon can throw picks in bunches. The senior threw multiple interceptions in five games in 2012, including four in the season opener and three in the season finale. He must get better at protecting the football in the NFL.

    When the pressure amps up, Jones' ball security is horrible. He was prone to poorly timed interceptions and fumbles. It was too much of a trend for it not to be a huge red flag entering the NFL.

    Intangibles:
    NFL prototype: Drew Brees, Saints

    Matt Barkley
    Ryan Nassib
    E.J. Manuel
    Tyler Wilson
    Mike Glennon
    Geno Smith
    Zac Dysert
    Landry Jones

    Recap: The only quarterback with bad intangibles is Jones. He isn't a bad teammate, but he rarely ever performed well in crunch time or elevated his play when his team needed it. Jones completely lacks the "it" factor. Dysert didn't elevate against better competition either.

    Smith was bipolar in college. There were times when he sulked on the sideline and acted extremely immature. At the same time, former teammates have told WalterFootball.com that he has leadership skills, works hard and is well-liked in the locker room. It seems to be a mixed bag with Smith's intangibles.

    Glennon, Wilson, Manuel and Nassib are all pretty equal. Each has a reputation as a good teammate who embrace a leadership role. All of them are said to have good work ethics. They had some clutch second-half performances in their careers and some games where they fell flat.

    Barkley is known to be a good guy off the field who represents his team well. He is also known as a positive presence in the locker room. Barkley tries to rally his team on the sidelines. His intangibles are perhaps his best asset.

  6. #6
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    This is like picking side in bum fighting...

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iggloo View Post
    This is like picking side in bum fighting...
    I , in no way, see EJ Manuel going no.1 . But I see him as the only QB that will make noise in his 1st or 2nd year.

    Not sure if Walter Football's info is post bowl season / Senior Bowl.

    But regardless, I don't get the hype on an Air Raid QB that got killed whenever he faced a decent defense. If Geno was in the SEC , we wouldn't even have this conversation.

    Instead of showing me a gif of a pass play against Texas (a game which he looked horrible at) ... can someone give me a rational argument as to why he crashed and burned BRADY QUINN AGAINST OHIO STATE AND LSU STYLE against K-State, Texas Tech, Syracuse , etc.

    REMEMBER

    WEST VIRGINIA LOST 5 GAMES IN A ROW UNDER THIS GUY.


    I've never heard of a QB that lost 5 consecutive games in college get praised like he's a legitimate Top 10 QB.

  8. #8
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    Clear bias/delusion here. I mean, EJ Manuel at #1 speaks to that, but that aside, Geno looked horrible against Texas? So he's on the road, against a fast, talented defense, and he goes over 71% completions, 4 TD, 0 INT, wins the game despite his defense giving up 45 points, and he's horrible?

    Yeah, OK.
    Last edited by Wyndham; 02-08-2013 at 07:39 PM.

  9. #9
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    Its not like his numbers were horrible in those games. The only reason his efficiency dropped at all is because he had to throw so many damn passes in that game. I think the Walter football guys do a pretty good job on analyzing him above. He's a plus in a lot of areas. Good arm strength,accuracy,vision and mobility being the summation of it.
    "Governing doesn’t disappear when government shrinks; instead corporations come to govern your life — like HMO’s, oil companies, drug companies, agribusiness, and so on, with accountability only to maximizing profit, not to public needs." - George Lakoff

  10. #10
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    I personally like Manuel as much as any QB in this draft, but still would not touch him in the first round.

  11. #11
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    Manuel's physical tools are undeniable, and I can see the appeal later in the draft, but he's not even comparable to a guy like Geno.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wyndham View Post
    Manuel's physical tools are undeniable, and I can see the appeal later in the draft, but he's not even comparable to a guy like Geno.
    Let's just agree that none of these guys are that good. It's nothing close to Tannehill vs Luck & RGIII. The gaps between these guys are blurry, IMHO.

    And yeah, Wyn, say what you want about Manuel. In practices, interviews, and especially the game - Manuel outplayed Wilson, Glennon, Dysert, and Nassib. He was by far the most confident.
    Now in terms of "long term potential" you could argue that those guys might have it better. I'm not sure how much I love the conversation of "long term potential". Veteran Draft Scouts keep
    acting like rookies will likely sit on the bench for a year or two until they're ready. Outside of Rodgers, there isn't a great example of a bench-sitting-qb.

    You really have to say "can they play now and work their way up" ? And to me , the only player out of those listed that could win a Week 1 game is Manuel.
    If you have a guy on the bench for a year ... he'll be replaced by another rookie. The coaching changes and assistant coaching changes in this league mixed in with the fact that
    owner can be easily convinced to spend high picks on QBs in back-to-back years is here.

    The Browns fanbase and front office seem to have already given up on Weeden. Gabbert was called a flub after his first season. Patience no longer exists for Quarterbacks.

    And yeah, Geno's numbers were pretty bad in all of those games. But if you watch the games and look past the numbers (Syracuse ) - the guy just tanked in the 2nd half of the season.
    If he didn't have to play Iowa St or Kansas in the final two games, it would've looked less inciting.

    Geno didn't want to play in the Senior Bowl. In a year where it could have solidified him as the NO.1 OVERALL PICK.
    I was Pro Geno in September. But every move he's made in October til now has just been ugly. And the truth is that I think he didn't attend or
    he was TOLD not to attend because the experience would hurt his status more than help it. To me, that is what is scary.

  13. #13
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    I doubt Geno "didn't want to play in the Senior Bowl". Generally, that decision is made by whoever is advising you and it if they didn't have him go to the senior bowl, its probably because they didn't think it would help his status, or didn't think his status needed helping.

    I am very intrigued by Manuel, but all the reports seem to be that he doesn't have it in him mentally to be a QB. He really struggles with reads and decision making as well as accuracy. He's a good guy, he's a leader and he has great physical tools, but if those other things are true, he'll never be much of anything in the NFL.
    "Governing doesn’t disappear when government shrinks; instead corporations come to govern your life — like HMO’s, oil companies, drug companies, agribusiness, and so on, with accountability only to maximizing profit, not to public needs." - George Lakoff

  14. #14
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    Dude, Manuel in a week 1 would be like a fawn in the headlights of a freight train.

    And Geno solidified himself as the #1 QB by NOT attending the Senior Bowl. That aside, it's a question mark why he didn't attend, but it's not the end of the world, either. Whole lot of draft season left to determine what he is.

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    I will say another thing as well. It's prefaced by the fact that there's a whole bunch of time to go and it could be redundant by this time in April, but with that said: if Geno goes #1 overall, talking heads should STFU, because any NFL braintrust has forgotten more than they'll ever know about football, and KC in particular is in pretty good hands when it comes to evaluating QBs IMO with Reid and Dorsey at the helm.

    And with the same token, if they pass, I'll concede that he's probably doomed for failure, because I know Reid will think he can coach a talented guy up, so it'd be telling if he passes. At this very moment I'm sticking with him being the pick.

    EDIT: Not that all talking heads are regurgitating the same rubbish. It seems to be spearheaded by ESPN, the network which has an amusingly strong hold over general fan.

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