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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThankGod4Walsh View Post
    Just saying that one person's testimony needs some corroborated evidence.
    O.M.F.G.

    You literally will say ANYTHING at ANY time to worm your way out of an argument regardless of whether it is a directly contradiction to everything you have ever said in the past.

    So first hand accounts by children sexually assaulted by Koresh are suspect but the stories of 90 year olds talking about how great life was in the 1910s are 100% spot on truth.
    The trouble with the world today is the intelligent people are full of doubt and the dumb people are full of confidence - Charles Bukowski

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by flyerhawk View Post
    O.M.F.G.

    You literally will say ANYTHING at ANY time to worm your way out of an argument regardless of whether it is a directly contradiction to everything you have ever said in the past.

    So first hand accounts by children sexually assaulted by Koresh are suspect but the stories of 90 year olds talking about how great life was in the 1910s are 100% spot on truth.
    I happen to agree with Walsh's statement, while knowing nothing about this context you complain about. I have seen many cases where people (often women) make false allegations, of both rape and domestic violence, even molestation against a spouse to enhance their outcomes in divorce proceedings - where they even get the kid to lie about it. People will and do make up some outlandish crap and get away with it in courtrooms across this country daily - and Juries are prone to believe them while listening to overzealous prosecutors acting like they were not only present during the alleged offense, but they can see into the evil minds and hearts and souls of the alleged perpetrator, when nothing is further from the truth. Many innocent people are in prison due to this, and only a fortunate few are ever exonerated with new DNA technologies. It is true that many are guilty with only the victim/witnesses' account, but it's also true that often they are not, and even 'corroborating evidence' can be manufactured by these types. We are seeing it right now in Arizona with the Jody Arias case in which this murdering wench is trying to claim self-defense.
    Gang Way!

  3. #63
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    I wish everybody could see the unedited VHS tape that Koresh made himself interviewing the girls and women of the compound.
    "the blade itself incites to violence." - Homer

    --

    "There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." - Kung fu Monkey

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by CalgaryHawkFan View Post
    I wish everybody could see the unedited VHS tape that Koresh made himself interviewing the girls and women of the compound.
    It won't convince some people, as it is your hearsay, and you are an unreliable liar.

    But from one unreliable liar to another, I would be interested in some of the highlights of the tape and your impressions of it, if you would be so kind as to oblige.
    The consistent factor of all of your dissatisfying relationships and failures is you.

    R.W. 09.21.10 I love you.

  5. #65
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    what I find most reprehensible about Koresh, even worse than his molestation of kids (if he's guilty of that), is that he used those children as shields and even made them pay with their lives for it. If he wanted to play tough guy with the Fed Gov he should have had the brass to let those children go and go out in a hail of ****fire. Leave the kids out of it, Lunkhead, you can part the prairie wide with your Omniscient Powers and Save The Day for all - or beat them in Court with your powers of persuasion. Ultimately that guy was a Royal *****, and the ultimate blame for it does fall on him, IMO. It is rare, but not unheard of, to see someone objectify children to quite the extent that Koresh did.
    Last edited by Rear Admiral; 01-30-2013 at 09:22 PM.
    Gang Way!

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superbelt View Post
    But from one unreliable liar to another, I would be interested in some of the highlights of the tape and your impressions of it, if you would be so kind as to oblige.
    +2...
    "I would not join any club that would have someone like me for a member." - Groucho Marx

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rear Admiral View Post
    I happen to agree with Walsh's statement, while knowing nothing about this context you complain about. I have seen many cases where people (often women) make false allegations, of both rape and domestic violence, even molestation against a spouse to enhance their outcomes in divorce proceedings - where they even get the kid to lie about it. People will and do make up some outlandish crap and get away with it in courtrooms across this country daily - and Juries are prone to believe them while listening to overzealous prosecutors acting like they were not only present during the alleged offense, but they can see into the evil minds and hearts and souls of the alleged perpetrator, when nothing is further from the truth. Many innocent people are in prison due to this, and only a fortunate few are ever exonerated with new DNA technologies. It is true that many are guilty with only the victim/witnesses' account, but it's also true that often they are not, and even 'corroborating evidence' can be manufactured by these types. We are seeing it right now in Arizona with the Jody Arias case in which this murdering wench is trying to claim self-defense.
    I think we all agree that single testimony is sketchy at best. So do the courts.

    However, there is only person here who seems to think that only his single person testimonies count.
    The trouble with the world today is the intelligent people are full of doubt and the dumb people are full of confidence - Charles Bukowski

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rear Admiral View Post
    I happen to agree with Walsh's statement, while knowing nothing about this context you complain about. I have seen many cases where people (often women) make false allegations, of both rape and domestic violence, even molestation against a spouse to enhance their outcomes in divorce proceedings - where they even get the kid to lie about it. People will and do make up some outlandish crap and get away with it in courtrooms across this country daily - and Juries are prone to believe them while listening to overzealous prosecutors acting like they were not only present during the alleged offense, but they can see into the evil minds and hearts and souls of the alleged perpetrator, when nothing is further from the truth. Many innocent people are in prison due to this, and only a fortunate few are ever exonerated with new DNA technologies. It is true that many are guilty with only the victim/witnesses' account, but it's also true that often they are not, and even 'corroborating evidence' can be manufactured by these types. We are seeing it right now in Arizona with the Jody Arias case in which this murdering wench is trying to claim self-defense.
    Flyer was simply pointing out that Walsh moves the goal net when it suits him. Guess you could say that about any one debating anything though...
    "I would not join any club that would have someone like me for a member." - Groucho Marx

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superbelt View Post
    Once his people murdered police officers serving a warrant, that basically sealed the whole thing.

    They couldn't have backed off and waited for him to go to town after that.
    After they killed the Agents they weren't going to be going to town for a soda pop. They holed up because they had to. And there is no reason other than pride that the Government couldn't have just fenced the place off and waited them out for starvation, cut their water/power, etc... I think they were ticked that they had the audacity to shoot their agents - and I would have been, too, but those children didn't do it. I do believe their survival instincts would have kicked in and vetoed the Great Wonderful Koresh who couldn't turn thin air into water afterall. But they elected not to do that 'for the kid's sake'. The botched the thing from start to finish, hence the result.

    Quote Originally Posted by Superbelt View Post
    And the warrant wasn't to arrest him, anyway. It was a search warrant to search his property for illegal weapons. It's 20/20 hindsight to say they should have gotten to him outside of the property.
    They sure did go in there heavy, expecting a confrontation - for a group of people with just a 'look-see' warrant. They knew he had an arsenal. They knew they were fanatics. They are highly paid law enforcement professionals who had an informant, too. It was easily foreseeable that the best option was to clip Koresh away from the compound, or they had nothing on him to do so - so they went there to start shyte KNOWING that children were inside there. If you know that children are inside on something like that you must plan for all contingencies that ensures their safety first.
    Last edited by Rear Admiral; 01-30-2013 at 08:34 PM.
    Gang Way!

  10. #70
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    Hmmm, at least it would beat Enut's desired homestead of living on oil barges out on the ocean.
    I'm your mama, I'm your daddy
    I'm that nigga in the alley
    I'm your doctor when in need
    Want some coke, have some weed
    You know me, I'm your friend
    Your main boy, thick and thin

    I'm your pusherman
    I'm your pusherman

    Ain't I clean, bad machine
    Super cool, super mean
    Dealin' good for the Man,
    Superfly, here I stand
    Secret stash, heavy bread
    Baddest bitches in the bed

    I'm your pusherman
    I'm your pusherman
    I'm your pusherman

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hyped View Post
    Flyer was simply pointing out that Walsh moves the goal net when it suits him. Guess you could say that about any one debating anything though...
    Few people do it so brazenly. We all try to move the debate to stronger ground for our positions. Walsh tries to airlift it to an entirely different location.
    The trouble with the world today is the intelligent people are full of doubt and the dumb people are full of confidence - Charles Bukowski

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superbelt View Post
    It won't convince some people, as it is your hearsay, and you are an unreliable liar.

    But from one unreliable liar to another, I would be interested in some of the highlights of the tape and your impressions of it, if you would be so kind as to oblige.
    It was his little narcissistic propaganda film. Final days, introducing the pretty women and pretty kids to the world. The guy was fvckign creepy. You could see in his eyes that he bought his own bullshvt. You could also tell that the women and kids were terrified, some of the younger kids weren't as I don't think they understood what was going on.

    It was heartbreaking knowing you were seeing these voices and wide eyes and emotions from beyond the grave, as all the kids/women (if memory serves) that were interviewed, perished.

    My own interpretation of course, since none of them screamed 'I'm being held against my will!' They mouthed platitudes about Koresh and how great he was, and how perfect their lives were, but you could see the palpable fear in their eyes.

    Creepy.
    "the blade itself incites to violence." - Homer

    --

    "There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." - Kung fu Monkey

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rear Admiral View Post
    After they killed the Agents they weren't going to be going to town for a soda pop. They holed up because they had to. And there is no reason other than pride that the Government couldn't have just fenced the place off and waited them out for starvation, cut their water/power, etc... I do believe their survival instincts would have kicked in a vetoed the Great Wonderful Koresh who couldn't turn thin air into water afterall. But they elected not to do that 'for the kid's sake'. The botched the thing from start to finish, hence the result.
    Well these folks were a cult. And there was the well being of the children inside to worry about. If they waited until things got bleaked they may have kool-aided themselves to the rapture.
    The trouble with the world today is the intelligent people are full of doubt and the dumb people are full of confidence - Charles Bukowski

  14. #74
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    I would have said that this was a much more appropriate place for Walshie to call home:

    "No two people on Earth are alike, and it's got to be that way in music or else it isn't music."—Billie Holliday

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hyped View Post
    Flyer was simply pointing out that Walsh moves the goal net when it suits him. Guess you could say that about any one debating anything though...
    Yeah, okay. I have no dog in that fight so I'll just stay out of it - I should have read back thru to see where the problem was but I'm not trying to blame Fly.
    Gang Way!

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