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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bridgeburner View Post
    So Popeye... are you saying that you don't believe it's a big enough problem to justify the cost then? Not putting words in your mouth, I'm asking.

    And Dave... your contention is that raising taxes or diverting money from other less important areas is not possible. Correct?
    In the current political climate it would be pretty hard to get a new large government program approved. And the people who would primarily oppose it would the same EXACT people that are clamoring for it now. The NRA has, despite being the biggest proponent of such a measure, has done NOTHING to push an actual proposal forward. Instead they demand that the OTHER side offer such a proposal.
    The trouble with the world today is the intelligent people are full of doubt and the dumb people are full of confidence - Charles Bukowski

  2. #62
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    And for those that say that they want America unviolenced, I'd DEARLY love to peek at their DVR list. What do they watch? What do they read?

    Do we retroactively ban John Wayne? :)

    Uh-huh.
    "the blade itself incites to violence." - Homer

    --

    "There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." - Kung fu Monkey

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by CalgaryHawkFan View Post
    They KNOW this. :) It's like someone arguing that they don't care if gays get married SO LONG as we dump the word marriage for everybody, and replace it with 'social contract' or whatever.

    They KNOW that ain't happening. So they get to point to it, and crow about how enlightened they are, how solution oriented, when they know damned well it isn't happening.

    Or to use an example from the other 'side,' when Jim talks about how we should do away with universal voting, like he's being all contrarian against liberal ideas. He KNOWS that isn't happening.
    The only thing that I KNOW is that it isn't happening because people disregard it without discussion because the NRA suggested it. I'm sorry, but everything should be on the table and the people that won't even discuss this are a part of the problem.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by flyerhawk View Post
    In the current political climate it would be pretty hard to get a new large government program approved. And the people who would primarily oppose it would the same EXACT people that are clamoring for it now. The NRA has, despite being the biggest proponent of such a measure, has done NOTHING to push an actual proposal forward. Instead they demand that the OTHER side offer such a proposal.
    It would be very hard getting a large program like this approved and funded. I don't think that makes it a bad idea though. Like I've said before, we've focused more energy on lesser priories before.

    Can you detail the NRA's inaction? I was under the impression that they were funding the research required to make this happen. At least that's what they claimed they were doing at their press conference wasn't it? What's changed since then?

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by CalgaryHawkFan View Post
    And for those that say that they want America unviolenced, I'd DEARLY love to peek at their DVR list. What do they watch? What do they read?

    Do we retroactively ban John Wayne? :)

    Uh-huh.
    Blaming media is laughable. That, IMHO, was the NRA trying to draw the attention from itself and nothing more.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bridgeburner View Post
    The only thing that I KNOW is that it isn't happening because people disregard it without discussion because the NRA suggested it. I'm sorry, but everything should be on the table and the people that won't even discuss this are a part of the problem.
    Look, you've painted yourself into a corner here. You've said you'd raise taxes. Which again is fine n' all, it's like ME saying that I'd have two years of mandatory military service. Simply not going to happen.



    Not going to happen.
    "the blade itself incites to violence." - Homer

    --

    "There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." - Kung fu Monkey

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bridgeburner View Post
    It would be very hard getting a large program like this approved and funded. I don't think that makes it a bad idea though. Like I've said before, we've focused more energy on lesser priories before.

    Can you detail the NRA's inaction? I was under the impression that they were funding the research required to make this happen. At least that's what they claimed they were doing at their press conference wasn't it? What's changed since then?
    What have they actually proposed other than a magic bullet proposal?

    Obama already proposed funding more resource staff for schools which is more than the NRA has actually proposed. Yet several people here have criticized the President because he didn't knee jerk into a massive new spending program.
    The trouble with the world today is the intelligent people are full of doubt and the dumb people are full of confidence - Charles Bukowski

  8. #68
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    Republicans don't want to fund Hurricane Sandy relief, let alone new spending to prevent another Sandy Hook. Not without cutting funding somewhere else.

    This is their idea, but I am sure they won't want to cut any of their own favorite programs to get this. It will have to come from the social side of government.

    Maybe we should roll school security into the DOD?
    The consistent factor of all of your dissatisfying relationships and failures is you.

    R.W. 09.21.10 I love you.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by CalgaryHawkFan View Post
    Not going to happen.
    Okay. Cool. That's going to be my response from now on when we talk about gun bans.

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bridgeburner View Post
    Okay. Cool. That's going to be my response from now on when we talk about gun bans.
    And you will be absolutely correct, under this Congress.
    The consistent factor of all of your dissatisfying relationships and failures is you.

    R.W. 09.21.10 I love you.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bridgeburner View Post
    Okay. Cool. That's going to be my response from now on when we talk about gun bans.
    And if we're talking about a total ban it SHOULD be your response.
    "the blade itself incites to violence." - Homer

    --

    "There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." - Kung fu Monkey

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by flyerhawk View Post
    What have they actually proposed other than a magic bullet proposal?

    Obama already proposed funding more resource staff for schools which is more than the NRA has actually proposed. Yet several people here have criticized the President because he didn't knee jerk into a massive new spending program.
    What's a magic bullet proposal?

    The NRA proposed funding a plan and hiring experts to design security systems including armed guards and secure entrance ways. Obama, if I'm correct, wants to look into allowing schools to use grant money to pay resource officers.

    But that isn't my question. Where has the NRA demanded that the other side pay for their idea and where is the inaction in relation to what the expectation is? I would like to know. My ideas don't really mesh 100% with the NRA and I'm more than willing to lump them in with Obama and his pop-warner administration if you can back up your claims.

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by CalgaryHawkFan View Post
    And if we're talking about a total ban it SHOULD be your response.
    The point is I've been told numerous times that it's absurd that the NRA won't even come to the table to talk about gun bans. Heh. Maybe. But the other side, the ones pointing fingers, are just as bad. Maybe worse.

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bridgeburner View Post
    What's a magic bullet proposal?

    The NRA proposed funding a plan and hiring experts to design security systems including armed guards and secure entrance ways. Obama, if I'm correct, wants to look into allowing schools to use grant money to pay resource officers.
    No they did not. They proposed that we get armed security in our schools. When LaPierre was specifically asked who would pay for it he said, wait for it, the Federal government. The NRA has nowhere near enough cash to fund such a program. 100,000 schools in America. Each school would need at least 2 guards. You are talking a price tag approaching a hundred billions dollars a year.

    But that isn't my question. Where has the NRA demanded that the other side pay for their idea and where is the inaction in relation to what the expectation is? I would like to know. My ideas don't really mesh 100% with the NRA and I'm more than willing to lump them in with Obama and his pop-warner administration if you can back up your claims.
    They want the Federal government to pay for it.

    And who pays? Because we know that a third of the schools that already have armed policemen or some kind of armed guards there. Will the N.R.A. be prepared to help financially? Is it really-- is a budgetary matter feasible? Would federal grants be necessary to provide this kind of-- firepower?
    WAYNE LAPIERRE:
    Well, as I said, I mean we have all kinds of federal foreign aid we do. My gosh, we're doing two billion to train the police in Iraq right now. With all the money in the federal budget, if we can't come up with to do this, or something long it's country, the N.R.A. will. I'll tell you, we fund the (UNINTEL PHRASE) child safety program right now as a model, the schools, for kids too young to be around guns.
    You know what it teaches them? If you see a gun, stop, don't touch it, leave the area, all an adult. Written by the best child psychologist and elementary school curriculum experts in the country. And we have child actions down to the lowest level every--
    The trouble with the world today is the intelligent people are full of doubt and the dumb people are full of confidence - Charles Bukowski

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bridgeburner View Post
    The point is I've been told numerous times that it's absurd that the NRA won't even come to the table to talk about gun bans. Heh. Maybe. But the other side, the ones pointing fingers, are just as bad. Maybe worse.
    Can you point to a single thing that Obama issued yesterday that you oppose?
    The trouble with the world today is the intelligent people are full of doubt and the dumb people are full of confidence - Charles Bukowski

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