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  1. #16
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    People use both strategies depending on the situation and the factors in those decisions are hopelessly intermingled.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by CrazyCoughlin View Post
    I remember in social psych class I took a stance that there's no such thing as a selfless good deed. There is clearly self interest involved in yelling look out. If you don't you feel terrible. So it's to make yourself feel better. But, if it's a split second decision I don't think you think about that, so you may be right.
    No question. Cognitive dissonance works wonders. Suddenly the crappy car you ended up buying "isn't so bad once you get used to it" Either that or you admit you were a stupid idiot for buying such a lemon.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by CrazyCoughlin View Post
    I guess the environmentalist identity plays a part too. I think the example though was more geographic.
    I guess I'm saying there are a lot of factors beyond geography although, like you said, even geography plays a part in establishing ones identity where you "don't want people to mess with Texas" or you think "there's New York and then there's the rest of the county" Clearly the political parties have staked what beliefs and values they represent and value. Hasn't that been much of the discussion for the past week?
    Last edited by PatsFan2003; 11-14-2012 at 04:49 PM.

  4. #19
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    I think that if you enjoyed 'Switch' you'll enjoy 'Thinking Fast Thinking Slow'.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by ctc View Post
    I think that if you enjoyed 'Switch' you'll enjoy 'Thinking Fast Thinking Slow'.
    After devouring Made to Stick, I've actually been pretty disappointed Switch. The reason I've been putting off reading it for a while, I think is the reason I didn't enjoy switch is because the topic is way more dry than made to stick. Thanks for the suggestion though.

  6. #21
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    Identity if far more complicated than what's being talked about here, which might make the identity model seem less true. Clearly, not everyone in Texas thinks the same way and the different ways we think are driven by myriad psychosocial constructs. Simple cultural identifiers like, "Republican," "gay," "Texan," "Tea Party," etc., cannot on their own make sense of a person's decision making.

    As a minister, this has become a big part of my work. I regularly counsel people on how they make decisions. For the most part, people don't sit down and figure out what to do. Even if they take time to think, they often ultimately simply react out of some base desire or fear. Part of the function of religion is to transform a person's identity so that those reactions come out of one's true self, in harmony with who one is created to be. For example, praying for those who hunger is, at least in part, an exercise in transforming one's identity into the sort of person who is concerned for the hungry and realizes opportunities to act on that concern. The question then becomes: what kind of person do you want to be? What drives that desire?
    "And if there is nothing that can so hide the face of our fellow-man as morality can, religion can hide from us as nothing else can the face of God." -- Martin Buber

    "You do not like religion; we started from that assumption. But in conducting an honest battle against it, which is not completely without effort, you do not want to have fought against a shadow like the one with which we have struggled." -- Friedrich Schleiermacher

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by CrazyCoughlin View Post
    That assumes not one rich guy ever voted Democrat because he wants to help the poor or the poor guy voting for the Republican because he thinks Democrats are socialists.
    I'm certainly not saying that it is an all or nothing scenario, there are certain to be exceptions to almost every rule. What I am saying is that amount of people that Rush Limbaugh and Fox News can mobilize and go to the polls to vote against their own self interests far outnumbers the amount of truly rich people who voted for Obama (with that said, I have no demographic data to prove it). And I'm not saying they are stupid people, they are just a blank slate politically which allows Rush Limbaugh and Fox News to get to work. They are well oiled machines.

    MSNBC only wishes they could manipulate as well as Fox. But they still try...
    "A riot is the language of the unheard."

    -Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wounded Bear View Post
    I'm certainly not saying that it is an all or nothing scenario, there are certain to be exceptions to almost every rule. What I am saying is that amount of people that Rush Limbaugh and Fox News can mobilize and go to the polls to vote against their own self interests far outnumbers the amount of truly rich people who voted for Obama (with that said, I have no demographic data to prove it). And I'm not saying they are stupid people, they are just a blank slate politically which allows Rush Limbaugh and Fox News to get to work. They are well oiled machines.

    MSNBC only wishes they could manipulate as well as Fox. But they still try...
    1) There are more people who are rich than everyone else, so it's not saying much that people voting against what you perceive to be their self interest by voting Republican outnumbers rich people voting for Obama.

    2) I don't think there are many people that watch Fox News and listen to Limbaugh that are undecided. I think most of these people are already conservatives.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by CrazyCoughlin View Post
    1) There are more people who are rich than everyone else, so it's not saying much that people voting against what you perceive to be their self interest by voting Republican outnumbers rich people voting for Obama.


    Most people aren't rich. That's why the rich are called the 1%.

    More people in the 99% voted against their self interest than the 1% who went for Obama.

    Quote Originally Posted by CrazyCoughlin View Post
    2) I don't think there are many people that watch Fox News and listen to Limbaugh that are undecided. I think most of these people are already conservatives.
    Right and most of them are in the 99%, therefore they voted against their own self interest. For instance, I know a number of people in my parents retirement community who get governmnet aid to fix up their home, they are on medicare, they're receiving social security and most watch Fox News and voted for Romney.

    Attacking social security and giving medicare vouchers where they will have to spend $6,000 per person annually (according to the CBO) is not in their best interest.
    "A riot is the language of the unheard."

    -Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

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